To plot or not to plot?

Four Star Member Joined : 17 Jan 2008 Posts : 250

If I'm going to drive around the block in my neighborhood, I just get in the car and go. No problem, nothing new there, no twists, no unexpected turns, nothing much of interest. I find the trip was quick and easy, but mostly boring and usually unfillling.

However, if I am going to drive a couple of thousand miles, visit a few places along the route that I've never been, and see a lot of new and exciting things, I start with a road map. I may deviate from the planned route a few times during the trip, just because something caught my eye or my fancy, but I know where the trip is going to end, what most of my plans are for the time I spend there, and how I'm going to get back home.

I've heard many writers say they just start writing and let the characters dictate who they are, where they are, and what they will do. I've found that most of the time, not always mind you, but most of the time, the readers would have been better served had the author told his or her characters who they are, where they are, and what they are going to do. Too often characters are not well written unless they are well thought out, plots fall apart if the author doesn't understand where the story has been and where it is going, and in the long run the readers will lay the book down unfinished because it doesn't read very well. I find it very unprofessional to read about the leading ladies beautiful blue eyes in chapter one, and then see that they have changed to green by chapter nine.

This isn't being critical of those who don't want to actually work at their work, but it is stating a plain and simple fact. Books that the authors allow to write themselves are usually only readable by the author and his or her friends.

Shelagh said it best, I believe, when she said writing is hard work. The first draft is difficult, and it gets harder from that point on. Why make it more difficult by not knowing what you are going to write about, who you are going to write about, and what your good, fulfilling ending is going to be? If your characters wander all about the place, so will your readers.

I will take it a step farther and say that in my opinion good writing almost has to be structured in order to really be something that a lot of people want to read. Without structure, a writer who could be great will never be anything better than good.

Subject: Re: To plot or not to plot? Sun Apr 06, 2008 6:11 pm

I suppose it also depends on your point of view. It's what I love about this quote, and even if you do not like Stephen King, there is no arguing his success as an author:

"I don't take notes; I don't outline, I don't do anything like that. I
just flail away at the goddamn thing. I'm a salami writer. I try to
write good salami, but salami is salami. You can't sell it as caviar."

Right now I am working on a book with a very solid outline, and one with a salami approach. I'm going to see which one the publishers pick first. Cool

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Pam Robertson

http://andthebandplayedonmylawn.blogspot.com

Subject: Re: To plot or not to plot? Sun Apr 06, 2008 6:32 pm

I think there are various methods in writing.
I recently co-authored a story where there was no plan. My co-author started it and then I took it from that point. The co-author picked it up from where I left off and this went back and forth until we finally ended the story. The theme was romance and that just evolved until the climax (a play on words here). Lots of unexpected things happened that make it interesting and exciting.
The book I'm writing now does have a plot and an objective. It is not as fun as the other book was to write but in this story I know where I'm going and what I want to accomplish.
I remember taking a vacation in Europe where we got into the car and started to drive. The plan was to stop if something was interesting, and stay where we found it interesting. The goal was to relax and enjoy the vacation/trip. I think it has much to do with our own objective and that also has much to do with writing as well. If we get into the zone and the words fly, we know we are on the right track. If we are struggling, it might be better to stop and take a rest.
I think we all have our own writing style and that makes it unique.
This of course is just my opinion.
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"To Beirut and Back"
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Admin Joined : 11 Jan 2008 Posts : 2069 Location : UK

I like this one best Pam:

Some editors are failed writers, but so are most writers. - T S Eliot

Thanks Don and Don! I feel like I've been well and truly donned! Very Happy

Abe, I'm all for uniqueness! Wink

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Shelagh Watkins
http://shelaghwatkins.co.uk/

Four Star Member Joined : 17 Jan 2008 Posts : 250

We each have our opinion. Mine is that anything that helps make your book better should be considered.

I've also taken trips with no particular destination, Abe, and find them to be fun. However, if I am going to a distant city to work and want the results to be favorable, I need to know where I'm going, how I'm going, what I plan on doing while I'm there, and have some kind of idea on when I'll be coming home. If writing is a hobby, then an unknown destination is fine. If writing is something that you'd like to see become your work, then my opinion is that I want to know as much about it before I start as I can.

However, good luck to all of you, whichever path you choose.

Subject: Re: To plot or not to plot? Sun Apr 06, 2008 7:23 pm

Don,
I don't think that we disagree. It has to do with our individual objectives. The book may be simply one that is supposed to humurous with no plot whatsoever. If it is a serious subject, then the approach must also be serious.
I think writing can be fun and it can also be laborious. We choose the subject and the style of writing. It is our plan, not someone else's.
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"To Beirut and Back"
http://www.freewebs.com/abemarch

Four Star Member Joined : 17 Jan 2008 Posts : 250

Abe, I agree, actually. I also think writing should be fun, and I write quite a lot of humor. Check out the Redneck Riviera series on Amazon Shorts. But I have yet to find a comedy writer who will not admit that writing comedy is serious business.

I have no personal problem with however anyone wants to pursue their writing, only my opinions.

Admin Joined : 11 Jan 2008 Posts : 2069 Location : UK

I love all these opinions! It's the way we learn and grow. If we all thought the same way, we'd be a boring lot ... and we're not! The folks who live on the forum are a canny lot, good fun and good company!

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Shelagh Watkins
http://shelaghwatkins.co.uk/

Subject: Re: To plot or not to plot? Mon Apr 07, 2008 1:54 am

Abe that had to be a blast of a project. It'll be great to read it and see how you put it together. I have co-written articles and am working on co-writing a book for/about my grandmother so it's all pretty structured, but I do enjoy the unstructured nature of my story writing.

Love the TS Eliot quote Shelagh - I'll add that to my favourites too!.

Some of my best holidays were the ones that were free and unscripted, finding the coolest towns and museums to hang out. Of course, landing up in some small place in the middle of a festival did not work out so well; it was late, there was no room anywhere, and a reservation would have really paid off. Life really is a fascinating journey bounce

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Pam Robertson

http://andthebandplayedonmylawn.blogspot.com

Subject: Re: To plot or not to plot? Sat May 10, 2008 7:43 am

Wow!

I don't plot.
I enjoy it.
I don't suffer for my art.
I don't use an outline.
I let my characters run the show.

I am doing it all wrong.

But I can't imagine doing it any other way.
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~ JoElle ~
http://www.joellemartin.com

Subject: Re: To plot or not to plot? Sat May 10, 2008 12:42 pm

Jo'Elle,
as they say, "if it ain't broke, don't fix it."
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"To Beirut and Back"
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Subject: Re: To plot or not to plot? Sat May 10, 2008 3:15 pm

If writing is enjoyable, you are not working hard enough.

That's not really my impression at all. I don't swoon away at the joy of it, like some seem to indicate, but it's enjoyable in it's way.

What I would say is: it's enjoyable when it's going well.

I think high-powered writers like King would generally say the same sort of thing, actually.

Harold Robbins would just get an idea for a novel, think about it some, then sit down and start typing and stop typing when it was done. Ta-da.
Same thing for Mickey Spillane.

Don't sneer at these guys either. At one time both Robbins and Spillane were the best-selling writers in the world.
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Admin Joined : 11 Jan 2008 Posts : 2069 Location : UK

This seems to contradict your post on the Chatter Box board. Those who participate in the performance arts have to work their socks off (sometimes literally!) as you quite rightly pointed out. Same with sportsman. Natural talent will only take you so far.

Tiger Woods is a talented athlete who could have chosen a variety of sports. He opted for golf because he found it easy. Did he decide at a young age that he would just win competitions against boys his own age and be satisfied with that? No, he asked for lessons so that he could improve and beat boys twice his age.

Why should talent alone be enough for a writer?
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Shelagh Watkins
http://shelaghwatkins.co.uk/

Subject: Re: To plot or not to plot? Sat May 10, 2008 11:01 pm

I don't see the contradiction. Performing and plastic arts require the refining of technique. They get tired and bloody and bored because they are burning in muscule memory and coming in contact with things.

Writing isn't like that. There is very little of anything that could be called "technique".

Talent can be enough for a writer because we don;t have to acquire all that stuff. It;s pretty much about the way a writer "talks" and the way his mind works.

Lots of writers just sat down one day with no prior experience and knocked out a novel that sold, perhaps even became very successful. This just doesn't happen if you play violin or dance ballet or wnat to be in the NBA.

That's a good thing, actually.
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